Gun Buck Sweep vs. UC

[jfriske11]

We just completed our season and were able to mix a healthy blend of UC and Gun into our offense.  One of the challenges we had was making the rules for the OL consistent for both the UC and GUN.  One play specifically that was an issue was the Buck Sweep.  Without a filling FB, the C had to adjust his rules to cover the BS A-Gap, and it was pretty frustrating for him until we ironed it out with repetition.  Do any of you out there have a system that keeps things consistent across the board for the OL rules if running Gun and UC?

 

Thanks in advance!

[buckeye7525]

Coach, our rule UC was the same as in the Gun.  I know there are a lot of Wing t teams that keep their Center front side on Bucksweep but when we first put this play in our FB was a great ball carrier but not always willing participant in the blocking game so we put things together to keep him from having to make a critical block on the play.  We just told him to run Trap without the ball, running BS A to FS A.  

We told our Center he was "Reach-On-Away".  So, if he had a PS A gap nose guard that would be "reach", a head up NG would be "on", and "away" would be blocking back on a shade/2i DT.   

Our BST was going to scoop/cut-off so if there was anything in the BS B gap he was responsible for cutting it off.  

The only adjustment we had to make on Gun Buck we didn't on UC Buck was against double A gap defenses.  We have a call in to keep our FSG home and only pull the BSG.  

 

[Wes Elrod]

22 hours ago, jfriske11 said:

We just completed our season and were able to mix a healthy blend of UC and Gun into our offense.  One of the challenges we had was making the rules for the OL consistent for both the UC and GUN.  One play specifically that was an issue was the Buck Sweep.  Without a filling FB, the C had to adjust his rules to cover the BS A-Gap, and it was pretty frustrating for him until we ironed it out with repetition.  Do any of you out there have a system that keeps things consistent across the board for the OL rules if running Gun and UC?

 

Thanks in advance!

This a great topic to discuss IF................you want to include the BUCK in your offense

I only ran the play out of North / South..............made practice easier!! REALLY.............See attached diagrams

I got to where I liked the Gun version better than UC.............there is one little possible downside; without switching personnel (I despise doing that) your FB becomes your Buck runner; he might NOT be a good sweep-type runner....................however there is one possible UPside. If your QB is a good runner; the QB buck to the "nub" (see attached diagram) is an absolute "KILLER".

See attachments.................enjoy and good topic to discuss

oce

Buck 48 Special (7 sheets).pdf

[CoachHG]

1 hour ago, Wes Elrod said:

This a great topic to discuss IF................you want to include the BUCK in your offense

I only ran the play out of North / South..............made practice easier!! REALLY.............See attached diagrams

I got to where I liked the Gun version better than UC.............there is one little possible downside; without switching personnel (I despise doing that) your FB becomes your Buck runner; he might NOT be a good sweep-type runner....................however there is one possible UPside. If your QB is a good runner; the QB buck to the "nub" (see attached diagram) is an absolute "KILLER".

See attachments.................enjoy and good topic to discuss

oce

Buck 48 Special (7 sheets).pdf 249.26 kB · 1 download

We've been a big gun buck team in the past and brought it back this year. The double A and blitzing BSILB was a problem in the gun without the FB to fill.

Our solution has been to just pull BSG to block force, and block down with C and PSG as our base. We use formations to account for PSILB. If we get our TE and Wing covered then we either go Nasty, unbalance like coach E Suggests^^ or run b-gap trap. We haven't had much success running a-gap trap out of gun except vs. specific looks like a 4-3. We run it the same UC if we are running a lot of Gun. 

I know more teams are protecting their gun Buck with a backside RPO to hold BSILB. That's outside our wheelhouse but if anyone runs that successfully id love to learn about that.

[Wes Elrod]

18 hours ago, CoachHG said:

We've been a big gun buck team in the past and brought it back this year. The double A and blitzing BSILB was a problem in the gun without the FB to fill.

Our solution has been to just pull BSG to block force, and block down with C and PSG as our base. We use formations to account for PSILB. If we get our TE and Wing covered then we either go Nasty, unbalance like coach E Suggests^^ or run b-gap trap. We haven't had much success running a-gap trap out of gun except vs. specific looks like a 4-3. We run it the same UC if we are running a lot of Gun. 

I know more teams are protecting their gun Buck with a backside RPO to hold BSILB. That's outside our wheelhouse but if anyone runs that successfully id love to learn about that.

More good discussion

We never saw the double A gap thing BUT if you do; here is another possible answer............(see attached)

Ya'll know that I use formations out the wazoo; so this is why (Ithink) we do not see the double A gaps. You can make a well used adjustment in the block GX to YX; then adjust the formation (see attachment).

I think this would work......

enjoy

oce

Ride 48 YX Down - RT North Gun R.pdf

[CoachHG]

2 hours ago, Wes Elrod said:

More good discussion

We never saw the double A gap thing BUT if you do; here is another possible answer............(see attached)

Ya'll know that I use formations out the wazoo; so this is why (Ithink) we do not see the double A gaps. You can make a well used adjustment in the block GX to YX; then adjust the formation (see attachment).

I think this would work......

enjoy

oce

Ride 48 YX Down - RT North Gun R.pdf 36.48 kB · 0 downloads

We do run that. Its a great play. We also run this scheme with a slot or wing in motion as the kickout. We see less double A now that we are multiple in our formations, but we do see it now and then. The more common issue is the BSILB cross-blitzing to strong A when X pulls. We have counters and adjustments, but if we get caught in it when we pull both Gs its often a negative play. Id love to hear other ideas.

[CoachDerz]

They've got nothing to do with Bucksweep here, but I feel obligated to share my answers for the double A-gap front. I apologise for not being as in-tune with this thread...but here's my two-cents: Versus a split-8 front, looking like a 4-2 personnel with 2 overhang safeties and a post safety with double 2i's and two stack 40 LBers, (which we got a lot vs. Rutgers,) we had 4 plays that were solid for us: The old-school counter lead, Midline, Midline Triple, and a double option. (You can also run the handback and cowboy to either side vs. B-gap bubbles.)

-Midline we adjusted by having our onside OG kick the DE, the onside OT released for the stack LBer, we read the 2i, and had a white call on the backside. This was a double option and the twirl motion and pitchback took it outside, with the onside slot responsible for the overhang player off twirl action.

-Midline Triple we adjusted too, we read the 2i and the DE, so the onside guard pulls and leads outside. Since the overhang defender is the responsibility of the twirling slotback, the onside OG leads on first opposite colour, (an LB who gets away from us, or the F/S). Same rules for everyone else; onside OT is on the stack LBer, white the backside.

-Our double option vs. the split-8 defense was a bit unique, but proved effective. For lack of better description, it's Midline but "way the hell out there."  The tracks for the QB/FB are normal Triple steps and mesh, they are the double option (give-keep).  We are reading the DE, and the onside OT will outside release as wide as he possibly can and kick the overhang S/S. Onside OG down-blocks the onside 2i, the centre combos the offside 2i to the offside stack LBer with the offside OG and the offside OT protected his inside gap. The onside slot dropsteps and inserts for the stack LBer (same rules as Midline Lead, Midline Follow, and Belly, however - no twirl motion), and the offside slot runs his long motion and takes a decoy pitch path.

As for the cross blitz, I'm running the handback all blessed day vs. that and we're gonna have 500+ yards rushing because if they're running that LBer away from it they do not have enough guys to make the tackle.

I'm sorry that I can't contribute to the shotgun Bucksweep discussion, but these were our answers vs. the defenses you guys were talking about.

[CoachHG]

11 hours ago, CoachDerz said:

They've got nothing to do with Bucksweep here, but I feel obligated to share my answers for the double A-gap front. I apologise for not being as in-tune with this thread...but here's my two-cents: Versus a split-8 front, looking like a 4-2 personnel with 2 overhang safeties and a post safety with double 2i's and two stack 40 LBers, (which we got a lot vs. Rutgers,) we had 4 plays that were solid for us: The old-school counter lead, Midline, Midline Triple, and a double option. (You can also run the handback and cowboy to either side vs. B-gap bubbles.)

-Midline we adjusted by having our onside OG kick the DE, the onside OT released for the stack LBer, we read the 2i, and had a white call on the backside. This was a double option and the twirl motion and pitchback took it outside, with the onside slot responsible for the overhang player off twirl action.

-Midline Triple we adjusted too, we read the 2i and the DE, so the onside guard pulls and leads outside. Since the overhang defender is the responsibility of the twirling slotback, the onside OG leads on first opposite colour, (an LB who gets away from us, or the F/S). Same rules for everyone else; onside OT is on the stack LBer, white the backside.

-Our double option vs. the split-8 defense was a bit unique, but proved effective. For lack of better description, it's Midline but "way the hell out there."  The tracks for the QB/FB are normal Triple steps and mesh, they are the double option (give-keep).  We are reading the DE, and the onside OT will outside release as wide as he possibly can and kick the overhang S/S. Onside OG down-blocks the onside 2i, the centre combos the offside 2i to the offside stack LBer with the offside OG and the offside OT protected his inside gap. The onside slot dropsteps and inserts for the stack LBer (same rules as Midline Lead, Midline Follow, and Belly, however - no twirl motion), and the offside slot runs his long motion and takes a decoy pitch path.

As for the cross blitz, I'm running the handback all blessed day vs. that and we're gonna have 500+ yards rushing because if they're running that LBer away from it they do not have enough guys to make the tackle.

I'm sorry that I can't contribute to the shotgun Bucksweep discussion, but these were our answers vs. the defenses you guys were talking about.

Youve run handback from shotgun with the playside guard pulling away coach?

[CoachDerz]

Is it exactly like the handback from veer action? No! But essentially, yes we did run a bastardised version the play. Our mentality for Bucksweep from the gun to the FB was as a counter off Jet action, (bastardised Truck), so our "handback" counter from gun was also to the FB, but was off of our Power Read play (we thought about running it with the QB but we had buck trap installed for him).  Jet man comes in motion, guard pulls for Power Read, we fake the inside Jet handoff, FB false steps, takes the o/s handoff, and cuts inside, QB boots away.  The core of the series was essentially like buck series except our QB was the up-the-middle guy (except on boot), and our FB ran counter away. Not 100% of what you guys are talking about, but when that ILB is running then they do not have a guy to stop the FB.

[CoachHG]

On 12/1/2021 at 6:56 PM, CoachDerz said:

Is it exactly like the handback from veer action? No! But essentially, yes we did run a bastardised version the play. Our mentality for Bucksweep from the gun to the FB was as a counter off Jet action, (bastardised Truck), so our "handback" counter from gun was also to the FB, but was off of our Power Read play (we thought about running it with the QB but we had buck trap installed for him).  Jet man comes in motion, guard pulls for Power Read, we fake the inside Jet handoff, FB false steps, takes the o/s handoff, and cuts inside, QB boots away.  The core of the series was essentially like buck series except our QB was the up-the-middle guy (except on boot), and our FB ran counter away. Not 100% of what you guys are talking about, but when that ILB is running then they do not have a guy to stop the FB.

I think I can see it, but could you draw this up? Did you ever run it back to the weakside?

[CoachDerz]

Sorry for the late reply, I lost my flashdrive with Playmakr Pro on it so I wanted to look for that, but couldn't find it, so you guys will have to put up with my handwriting... YES when we started running the offense from the gun, we ran it more to the weakside because defenses were keying the TE/Y-off. The handback dive is designed to take advantage of flow so it was more natural that way. Here's how we adjusted the play. Not quite the same as running it from the 'bone, but it worked for those ILBs who wanted to scrape. We started doing this out of pistol, I think that was a bit better for timing, but not always the best position for the FB to lead for the A- & B-backs.

[Crashonbuck]

We ran under center buck and gun buck the same way. We run qb buck and we run buck with the slide motion to kick out. We have never run the hand back to the FB. But i am very interested, we didn't see any double a gap stuff. Mainly because we went uc/to gun with no personal changes. We also run enough rocket and belly so They couldn't really blitz us a lot. We had one of those kids at qb. He is gone next year. So i don't see it being as big of a play for us. 

[CoachSpencer82]

We have ran buck from gun, but I would like to run it from under center red/blue as a no motion play, jet series is our primary under center package, because we use so much motion I'm looking for something with no motion, would probably have a tag to tell C to reach front side A gap because we have the FB to fill backside A gap now.  Thoughts?